Welcome, Guest. Please Login
MCD - Mast Cell Disorders
  We've upgraded to YaBB 2!
  HomeHelpSearchLogin  
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print
I have a MCD and so does my dog: advice? (Read 2943 times)
larken
Guiding Light
***
Offline


I Love YaBB 2!
Posts: 136

I have a MCD and so does my dog: advice?
05/13/12 at 10:12:15
 
One thing I have never mentioned on the boards is that not only do I have MCAS, but my dog, a 12 year old Labrador, has had mast cell cancer since he was two.  Every year he would get 2 - 3 malignant mast cell tumors (graded in the medium range of severity), which are essentially huge clumps of mast cells under the skin.  Every year we would take him to the vet and have them removed.  Our vet explained that it was never systemic, but all these tumors popped up individually.  

So, after I was diagnosed two years ago with MCAS and discovered my food triggers (gluten, dairy, etc etc), I decided that I was going to apply what I had learned to my dog.  I took him off conventional dog food with meat bi-products and loads of corn and wheat.   I put him on a rice and raw meat diet, with some vegetables and vitamins mixed in. This has been the only major change in his life.  

One and a half years later, he has had no mast cell tumors.  

He has had 4 small lumps pop up, but they have all been tested on separate occasions by an excellent vet specialty practice (one of the best in Europe) and came back benign.  

Now, I'm really not sure what to think.  I'm certainly not saying I've found a cure for cancer.  But, after all I've learned about mast cell disorders (and unaware doctors!) I do think I should talk to someone about this.  Could be a connection.  I really want a good researcher to look into it.  However, I can't help but feel all "If you think I'm crazy for thinking I have a mast cell disorder, wait til you hear about my dog!" -- especially after the responses I got from 99% of human doctors for many years, and knowing how little human doctors in general know about mast cells.  What will the vets know?!  I suppose that my hesitancy comes down to feeling like people won't take me seriously.  

But, I feel it's worth it in the end.  Mast cell cancer is one of the most common in dogs.  And, we feed dogs grain!  How many dogs in the wild do you see munching on grain?    It wouldn't surprise me if this is a major mast cell trigger and conventional allergen for dogs.

I have searched online to try and find some research on the link between canine mast cell tumors, allergens and diet and I have come up with some fairly informal stuff, nothing too on-point (though there are some diet and cancer sites out there).  

Before I try to contact some vet specialists or researchers, what do all think about this?  You're all mast cell specialists by now!   Or, any veterinarians with MCAD out there have some advice?  

Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
WendyH
Tutor
**
Offline


I Love YaBB 2!
Posts: 93
Hurricane, UT
Re: I have a MCD and so does my dog: advice?
Reply #1 - 05/13/12 at 11:03:29
 
Wow that is amazing that you both have.  I don't see how grains can cause masto since its a genetic mutation.  It could just been that cutting out grains which could be a trigger for symptoms has helped your lab.  I guess it wouldn't hurt talking to the vet.  There are a few doctors on this forum you could ask.  Go to members and click on it and find them.  It could be very interesting.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Lisa
FORUM MODERATOR/ADVISOR
*******
Offline


I am not a doctor.
Posts: 1499
Volta Redonda, RJ Brazil
Re: I have a MCD and so does my dog: advice?
Reply #2 - 05/14/12 at 03:26:28
 
It´s well known about dogs and the mastocytomas.  And yes, it makes sense that your changing your dogs diet will give him improvement.  However, let me help you understand that what seems to be working on your dog doesn´t mean it´s going to work on humans.   Our systems are very different and it´s not just in the obvious anatomy situations.   This is something that we who have never studied medicine have a hard time understanding.  I´m not exactly sure how it all works out, for I´ve had only a few discussions with high level doctors dealing with this but when researchers are trying to find understanding about drugs and diseases, etc, they end up having to do research with various animals before any human trials or understanding can be gained and this is due to many factors.  For example, we humans can´t live without our mast cells - period.  And, as far as I know, every other mammal also needs mast cells.  Yet, they´ve managed to bread mice without any mast cells which is why they like to use mice to understand how the mast cell works with certain experiements for in not having any mast cells in those mice, they can see what happens differently on the mice with mast cells and those without.

The studies on the aortic aneurysms used mice without MCs and mice with MCs and when they forced aneurysms on their aortas and then gave contrast and then gave MC stabilizers they were able to compare the two groups of mice and see what the influence was that the MCs had.   They could never do this on humans.  

I read another article having to do with the influence of the effectiveness of anithistamines that were oral, intramuscular and intravenous and they tested mice, rabbits, dogs, rats and some other animals and depending upon the animal, some forms were more effective than others and they could only surmise how it would be for humans.  

Our tendancy is to say that animal testing is most effective with apes, but this too isn´t so.  Humans are not animals, we´re humans and what our bodies do is different and just because some scientists feel that they are our closest "cousins", but they are different from us and their bodies function differently and just because some things are similar or even alike, it doesn´t mean that everything will be so.  

Now, I do think, however, that what you are talking about is very interesting and I would suggest that you write to Dr. Gerhard Molderings in Germany and tell him about this.   Dr. Molderings is a geneticist, I believe, and he´s an authority on mastocytosis.  He may find these positive results in your dog to be interesting and he would have the capacity to explain to you why and why not if there is any understanding in this area.  You may also want to google for research on dogs and speak with an authority veterinarian about this to see what they think for they would be the ones to take this situation further if indeed it indicates anything.


Lisa

Back to top
 

Don´t forget, there is so much more to life than being sick!
 
IP Logged
 
larken
Guiding Light
***
Offline


I Love YaBB 2!
Posts: 136

Re: I have a MCD and so does my dog: advice?
Reply #3 - 05/14/12 at 09:45:08
 
Hi Ladies,

Thanks for your advice.  Lisa, I have been in touch with Dr Moulderings before, so he may be a good start.  Good suggestion!

Just to clarify, I didn't have in mind that researchers could use dogs for human research, but rather that veterinary researchers could do research for the benefit of other dogs.  I agree that it might not be so useful to do cross-species research.  Just look at how different humans are in their mast cell reactions!  

Also, I don't think that grains cause masto or unstable mast cells, but they can be triggers.  I break out in hives when I eat/experience my triggers and I'm wondering if mast cell tumors could be an analogous response in the skin of dogs.

Cheers,
Larken
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
missybean
Mentor
****
Offline


I Love YaBB 2!
Posts: 439
Washington
Re: I have a MCD and so does my dog: advice?
Reply #4 - 05/25/12 at 16:17:36
 
Larkin, I find this so interesting. Thanks for sharing.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
jbean
Mentor
****
Offline


I Love YaBB 2!
Posts: 286

Re: I have a MCD and so does my dog: advice?
Reply #5 - 05/29/12 at 05:48:11
 
I think it would depend upon what is a trigger and what is not.  So, hard to say.

What works in an animal does not always apply to humans.  Sometimes you can get useful clues though, so it is an interesting observation.  Also, perhaps your dog is getting more vitamins in general now so the immunity got a boost, and now is battling off the tumors more efficiently.

An unrelated, but interesting thing I noticed.  I was looking for a dog that I would not be allergic to, so I spent sometime around my friend's dog.  This type of dog had fur and was supposedly more allergenic.  However, it never bothered me one bit.

Interesting, the dog had a bad allergic disorder also.  So, maybe the dog and I had the same thing wrong, and hence, we got along fine with each other!  Pretty funny!
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send Topic Print